American Parkour Forum

Fitness and Training => General Fitness => Diet => Topic started by: Alissa J. Bratz on April 04, 2008, 09:48:02 PM

Title: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Alissa J. Bratz on April 04, 2008, 09:48:02 PM
So I was reading this article: http://www.trifuel.com/training/triathlon-training/seven-serious-barriers-to-achieving-your-goals-and-how-to-overcome-them

Because I'm in a HUGE funk right now, a very bad diet/training cycle that I can't seem to get out of: low motivation to exercise, lots of bad food choices (example: I ate two donuts today! I NEVER eat donuts! This is so weird...)

I thought his comments on diet were interesting. They managed to just touch on what could cause the problems, and hinted at a possible solution, but didn't really give any advice on how to go about fixing it aside from trial-and-error tweaks/adjustments to diet. I certainly agree that we all need to eat more vegetables and fruits, but his comments about food sensitivities sort of got me thinking. I have been having a lot of the symptoms from diet sensitivities that he mentions. I figured this had more to do with the fact that my diet had gotten horrible recently. When my diet is good, I eat a lot of the things that he says cause these problems: lots of eggs and dairy in particular. These are great sources of protein and with a diet like the Zone and others that are limited-carb, I imagine eggs and dairy figure relatively prominently compared to a standard "Food Pyramid" diet. This guy is obviously a serious athlete and obviously is in tune with how to eat to support that, so I found it interesting that he attributes sensitivities to seemingly "Zone-friendly" foods with being one of the main barriers to achievement. (Understand that here I am using "Zone" as a catch-all for any type of high-protein, high-veggie, natural, balanced diet that I assume is ideal for most athletes).

Thoughts/comments on this?

As a second point, I thought it was good to have a reminder that fitness is the result of a lot of interrelated factors: lack of sleep impacts diet, sugar impacts brain chemistry, which affects the drive to exercise, which affects sleep, and so on. So I am also wondering, where is a good place to start? It seems sort of cyclical, so theoretically I could start anywhere, just improve one thing and let the ball start rolling back in a good direction? I've been sort of shotgunning, trying to improve everything all at once as the motivation is hot (and it never is since I'm in a hole right now). My initial impression is that I should just focus on getting more sleep, and more water, for now, and then see if that increases my motivation bit by bit.

What are your thoughts on this?

Overall, I thought it was a pretty helpful article. Not terribly detailed, but a nice little reminder/kick in the butt. I'd be interested in hearing what you all have to say on this.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: gadget23 on April 05, 2008, 07:02:18 AM
Quote
When my diet is good, I eat a lot of the things that he says cause these problems: lots of eggs and dairy in particular. These are great sources of protein and with a diet like the Zone and others that are limited-carb, I imagine eggs and dairy figure relatively prominently compared to a standard "Food Pyramid" diet. This guy is obviously a serious athlete and obviously is in tune with how to eat to support that, so I found it interesting that he attributes sensitivities to seemingly "Zone-friendly" foods with being one of the main barriers to achievement.

I was also very surprised when he named those types of foods as a barrier. I love eggs and eat them quite a bit, and I always have a glass of milk after working out.

But when I read deeper, I realized that he may actually be right. If you were to follow any Zone (or related) diet, then you would begin to cut down on the unhealthier foods and started eating more fruits, vegetables, dairy, eggs, and the like. However, if you were to continue eating eggs, dairy, over and over again, what would at first seem like sticking to the diet would soon become, from your body's point of view, as eating "too much" of something. Most likely, your body would start developing a resistance mechanism in the form of an allergy towards it. Because too much of anything causes your body to respond to it. I have heard of cases where people eat something like peanuts so often, the body becomes allergic to it.

Quote
As a second point, I thought it was good to have a reminder that fitness is the result of a lot of interrelated factors: lack of sleep impacts diet, sugar impacts brain chemistry, which affects the drive to exercise, which affects sleep, and so on. So I am also wondering, where is a good place to start? It seems sort of cyclical, so theoretically I could start anywhere, just improve one thing and let the ball start rolling back in a good direction? I've been sort of shotgunning, trying to improve everything all at once as the motivation is hot (and it never is since I'm in a hole right now). My initial impression is that I should just focus on getting more sleep, and more water, for now, and then see if that increases my motivation bit by bit.

I would do (and will, because I'm in a rut too :( ) exactly what your initial impression would be. Start slow, don't try to go for the whole thing at once, because your body will get overwhelmed. Start with more water, then more sleep, then perhaps work on the main factor, the diet.
Jumping straight in would be like going from couch potato to someone who works out 3 days a week and runs 2 miles a day. It would be much easier to slip back into a "couch potato" that way.
Same with parkour. If you go straight into it and jump off of a 6 foot wall, your going to break your leg.


I'm in a very bad cycle aswell, and this article is a good starting point. Thanks for sharing  :)
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Steve Low on April 05, 2008, 01:25:12 PM
1. Read Robb Wolf's blog.

http://robbwolf.com/index.php?paged=6

2. Dairy, soy and gluten products I've seen as being irritants but NOT eggs. Although could be for some people.

3. You're forgetting there's a lot of other things you can eat with fruits, vegetables, dairy and eggs namely: nuts, all kinds of meats, fish, higher fat content stuff like almond butter, olive oil, etc.

4. Paleo tends to avoid those foods he was talking about if you were concerned about that. Robb's blog is mainly Paleo/IF. If you want stuff on Zone check out CF nutrition forums and post up a few questions (but SEARCH first cause most of them have been asked).

5. Gonna go opposite of what gadget said. With something like Zone or Paleo just trash the junk in your house and go for it. There's tons of people to keep you honest on CF if you post up your stuff and ask people to keep you accountable (or you can keep yourself accountable for everything you mess up do X pushups or whatever).
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: gadget23 on April 05, 2008, 03:23:58 PM
5. Gonna go opposite of what gadget said. With something like Zone or Paleo just trash the junk in your house and go for it. There's tons of people to keep you honest on CF if you post up your stuff and ask people to keep you accountable (or you can keep yourself accountable for everything you mess up do X pushups or whatever).

That may be true, but isn't there more of a chance of relapse that way? For example:

Jumping in: Starting the very next day, you decide to:
- Eat no more chips, candy, soda
- Workout 5 times a week
- Go to sleep 3 hours earlier
- Drink 8 glasses of water

or,

Easing in:
- tomorrow i'll drink 8 glasses of water
- next week i'll starting going to bed 3 hrs earlier
- the week after i'll start working out 5 times a week
- after that, i'll fix my diet by not eating anymore junk

It just seems easier (albeit longer) to ease in than jump in.


Of course, if you mean just specifically diet, then yeah, your right, throw away all that crap. But for a total health change, it takes time.


That being said,

Quote
...you can keep yourself accountable for everything you mess up do X pushups or whatever.

I am SO doing that from now on  :D
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Alissa J. Bratz on April 05, 2008, 04:53:11 PM
I should clarify. When I say my diet is "crap," it is still much healthier than the average person's. The fluke donuts aside, I am still eating lots of lean protein and veggies; it's just that I have also been allowing myself to eat white rice in large quantities (Chinese takeout twice this week; usually it's a once-a-month treat, tops), when I feel too tired to cook veggies I'll just have my lean meat + some cheese and whole-grain crackers, not enough water in a day, etc. I haven't had chips or soda in something like 10 years, and the only candy I have is the occasional artisanal chocolate (usually just one or two, made from organic single-source cocoa and very little else, from a woman who makes them in small batches here (http://www.gailambrosius.com/)). If it's around a holiday I usually have a handful or two of "mass-produced" candy (M&Ms, candy hearts, whatever), but those are few and far between.

A typical day for me, food-wise, looks something like this when I'm not being exceptionally mindful of food:

Breakfast: 1 slice whole-grain toast w/ 2T. almond butter, 1/2 cup plain yogurt or skim milk, 6-12 oz. coffee (I will add an egg to this on long rehearsal days)

Snack: 8 oz. pre-packaged low-sugar smoothie

Lunch: usually leftovers from dinner the night before; sometimes a sandwich made with two slices whole-grain bread, turkey or roast beef, mayo, lettuce, and cheese, plus 1/2 liter water.

Snack: cashews, cheese and whole-grain crackers, veggies and dip, 1/2 liter water

Dinner: Some kind of lean meat, some kind of steamed vegetable, salad with vinegar and oil. 1/2 liter water and/or a glass or two of wine.

So, it's not bad, but it's not optimized either. I tend to be pretty okay with it. The problem is that lately I've been sneaking snacks, taking larger quantities of stuff, having a brownie here or a cookie there; whatever's in the teachers lounge; skipping lunch and then having a big handful of Chex mix when I'm hungry later, totally ignoring the water intake, etc. In other words, like above where I mentioned the occasional handful of M&Ms around a holiday--but I've been treating every other day like a holiday lately. It's basically just me not paying attention to my food.

I think what struck me most was how important sleep was to pretty much everything else and that was a large piece of my problem. I have absolutely not been getting enough sleep lately. From what the article said it sounds like this has been the primary cause of my lack of motivation to exercise and also my total lack of mindfulness towards food. My main question was just that I was feeling like a commitment to adequate sleep might be the way to get me back on the wagon, and I was wondering what people thought of that. It seems sort of counterintuitive: sleep better to eat better, but at the same time good sleep is a part of health and everything is interconnected.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Steve Low on April 05, 2008, 10:07:14 PM
Sleep is definitely probably the most important part. You sleep like crap then you feel like crap and it affects everything. While nutrition is also a huge factor, it is possible to live decently with half-crap food (although it puts you more at risk for stuff, heh). Working out is honestly the highest part of that pyramid but done right it can affect the lower portions as well.

But yeah... depends on the person. Especially in terms of jumping right in or making slow changes. Some people can go gradual and some people won't go gradual so you gotta make them do stuff.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Chris Salvato on April 06, 2008, 03:46:50 PM
Quote
These are great sources of protein and with a diet like the Zone and others that are limited-carb, I imagine eggs and dairy figure relatively prominently compared to a standard "Food Pyramid" diet.

Not to nitpick but the Zone is really not a limited carb diet at all.  Its a fixed caloric scheme that is actually PRETTY GENEROUS with carbs compared to many other dieting ideologies.

The FDA approved Food Pyramid just happens to be a bunch of crap based on old data and misinformed scientists.  Grains on a whole are dangerous to consume en masse because of their high glycemic index and high concentration of carbohydrates yet the Food Pyramid still recommends that you get 6-11 servings per day. 

This has led to a poorly informed, brain-washed, close-minded, obese america:
1) Poorly informed because they think that amount of carbs (particularly GRAINS/RICE) is good. 
2) Brain Washed because people will fight you to the death to defend that a bran muffin with jelly is a healthy breakfast.
3) Closed- Minded because few people will stray from the pyramid and actually research nutrition.
4) Obese because they refuse to listen to their bodies and competent sources for nutritional advice

Quote
That may be true, but isn't there more of a chance of relapse that way? For example:

Jumping in: Starting the very next day, you decide to:
- Eat no more chips, candy, soda
- Workout 5 times a week
- Go to sleep 3 hours earlier
- Drink 8 glasses of water

or,

Easing in:
- tomorrow i'll drink 8 glasses of water
- next week i'll starting going to bed 3 hrs earlier
- the week after i'll start working out 5 times a week
- after that, i'll fix my diet by not eating anymore junk

It just seems easier (albeit longer) to ease in than jump in.


Of course, if you mean just specifically diet, then yeah, your right, throw away all that crap. But for a total health change, it takes time.

I have said it before and I will say it again.  Avoid blanket statements.  You will find this useful in nutrition, fitness and life in general, imho.

People respond differently to different approaches on how to best get into a proper fitness routine.  Personally, I jumped right in.  As soon as I learned my granola was high in saturated fat, I cut it out.  When I learned that my bagels were spiking my insulin, no more bagels.  Things like that.  I had trained other people into fitness and weight loss routines and sometimes easing the client into that is easier on them, especially if they are obese.  Remember, you will also have to deal with the fact that most people are brainwashed (as stated above) and don't understand how a muffin with jelly is a bad meal.  Easing them out of their mentality is useful for this closed minded group while someone more open minded and willing to do research and reading may just jump right into a new routine of diet and nutrition.

Saying one method is better than the other is senseless and will likely make you a worse trainer and motivator since you are not respecting personal differences between the people to which you are giving advice.

Quote from: Muse_of_Fire
So, it's not bad, but it's not optimized either. I tend to be pretty okay with it. The problem is that lately I've been sneaking snacks, taking larger quantities of stuff, having a brownie here or a cookie there; whatever's in the teachers lounge; skipping lunch and then having a big handful of Chex mix when I'm hungry later, totally ignoring the water intake, etc.

As stated above, optimized is a VERY particular and unique word in fitness and nutrition.  What is optimal for you is not optimal for someone else.  You may be more sensitive to insulin.  You may need more calories.  Things like that.

If you are hungry, sneaking snacks, taking larger quantities then this is your body telling you it needs something.  Unfortunately, you are not familiar with what it is trying to tell you.  Cut out the junk food, before you get into a bad habit of eating it when this sensation comes along.  You need to identify what this sensation means.

You are just coming off of a sickness, right?  Your body is now recovered, back into activity and perhaps, int hat time, your caloric demands increased.  Keep increasing your portions but remember to keep them balanced.  If you are still hungry after you increase your portions, next time, try to play with the ratio of carb/fat/protein.  Over time, you will learn what this sensation your body is putting out actually means.  You may find that it just means that you need more protein in a certain meal than you thought, or more (good) fat.

Start with balanced meals then tweak the balance and portion to your liking.  By all means, up your calories.  See if you put on weight while maintaining or shrinking your Body fat percentage.  Putting on weight is not a bad thing.

Let me know if I was helpful at all.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Alissa J. Bratz on April 06, 2008, 04:42:54 PM
You were helpful, phreak. I honestly think I've been "naughty" with regard to food because I have been so sleep-deprived that I am craving sugary stuff for the energy spike. Plus with all the other brain chemistry stuff that the article talked about being a result of lack of sleep, the stuff that makes you crave things and unable to interpret your body's signals, etc; I think I have just been falling into a freefall of mixed signals from my body. I think it was just in "stress mode" from lack of sleep and a hectic schedule: "Not sure when we're going to eat again, and we're so tired, so just keep sending hunger signals, get all the sugar, get the boosts you can to just get through this," etc.

In the past week or two I have put on "a ton" of weight  (I'm guessing 1-2 lbs.) and to me it looks more like fat than muscle. Things that used to be lean are now a little jiggly, and my leotard and tights feel tighter (that nice "sausage" feeling... blech). So I'm certain it's diet (I am also on some new medication that is causing all sorts of havoc with my body, so some of the weight gain might be attributed to that as well). I just never really considered before how much sleep factors in to that until I read the article.

At this point I am going to just try to commit to at least 7 hours of sleep a night, minimum (I average about 5, usually... so bad), and also to drinking 1.5 liters or more of water per day, and see if that doesn't regulate things out a little bit. Already this weekend I've had a much more normal (for me) diet. The way I usually eat, described in my "typical" day a few posts up, seems to work well for me. I guess I say it's not optimized because I feel like I could be more attentive to protein/carb/fat ratios in each meal. I kind of eyeball stuff, and if I eat too many carbs in one meal, for instance, I'll eat less in the next, and so on. It works for me in terms of keeping me lean and feeling energized, but I have a feeling if I really started "listening and tweaking" on a micro level, I'd get a lot more gains, fitness-wise. But honestly I'm not motivated to make those kinds of changes except on a very small scale, and on a needs basis (e.g. feeling anemic=eat more read meat that week, etc.)

I don't think I'm making any sense here... it's been kind of an ongoing problem all week.  :-[

Thanks, anyway, for all your help. I will see how the sleep works for the time being.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Chris Salvato on April 06, 2008, 05:00:18 PM
as usual, my advice goes from the ground up -- fix all of the obvious problems first (ie junk food, lack of sleep, etc)


If you are serious about getting into a nutritional routine and you think the Zone is good for you (i personally believe the zone is good for everyone since it really emphasizes tweaking meals to your own personal needs) then you can always ask me questions on that. 

Really though, the best thing to do are pick up the books by Barry Sears and read/understand them as much as you can.

What you are doing in regards to your diet, based on your "needs", is really good.  However, you may not be interpreting all of the signals properly -- just like when learning how to understand your body's balance signals while doing a handstand, you also need to practice understanding your body's signals in regards to diet.  Getting started on the zone diet, in the way that Sears breaks down in his book, is a superior way to get to that level of understanding of your body.

Every day I learn what my body is trying to tell me in new ways.

You're a smart girl.  You will be fine.  Just remember that your body doesn't "know" about stress or cortisol or insulin or brain chemistry.  You, as a mind, experience your body in "I'm hungry", "I'm full", "I'm cold".  Sometimes reading about all of the mechanics behind your moods and body composition really make learning how to take advantage of them a bit more difficult. 

When teaching someone a squat, telling them to "straighten their back" is useless.  However, telling them something like "Chest up ", "Ass out", "Look where my feet are" will all help straighten their back much more.  As humans, we understand there is something more, like a straight back.  As animals, we only know what we are used to.  Get your body used to more and understanding things from new angles and perspectives.

This is parkour ground down to its finest grains of sand, so it should be easy for you to understand as a traceuse.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Charles Moreland on April 07, 2008, 06:15:16 AM
Hi Muse, sorry I've been real busy this past week. There's a ton of good info here for you, though so I won't have to say much.

Regarding your stress response, that's actually not what your body is going through. The state you described is actually what happens when you skip meals. Skipping meals doesn't lose weight, it actually causes you to gain fat for this same reason. Your body enters a state where it doesn't know when the next time it will be fed will be, and so goes into a catabolic state producing more fat.

I have a feeling you're just stressing too much with daily life on top of being sleep deprived. Follow phreaks advice toward your diet, but also try and remember, this is Spring! Final stretch is coming in and hopefully won't last too long for you as a teacher. This summer you may want to consider some yoga classes or anything that can get your mind back on track to handle the craziness you put yourself through ;)

Also, obviously assess yourself every so often in regards to visual body comp, weight, etc. But don't let these facts dawn on you throughout entire days or weeks. The more it dawns on you the more of a perceived problem it becomes and suddenly problems appear ten times worse than they actually are. It's how the mind works. We go back to the infamous, "I eat because I'm depressed; and I'm depressed because I eat," sort of deal. This isn't something to be depressed about and depression will only cause more pounds. Cheer up. Block it from your mind throughout the day. Work on tasks at hand and keep something healthy nearby. Keep reminding yourself that this only a slight "issue" and can easily be fixed and corrected just like many of your student's test papers   :P
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: BobT on April 07, 2008, 01:18:14 PM
I've posted this before, but I'll say it again.  Food allergies quite often have a genetic component.  An allergy is an auto-immune problem and not everyone will develop them.  If you don't have a personal or family history, don't sweat the eggs, etc.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and throw out a different suggestion.  Are you eating enough?  Eating lots of non-processed food is great for the diet because it has less bio-availablilty than refined foods.  For a given caloric intake, your body will digest less calories from healthy foods than from processed foods.  You dance, you train for PK and honestly, I would be starving with the meal plan you posted  :-\  Not that I'm the poster child for a ripped midsection, but I'm not the poster child for a nuclear metabolism either.

Under-eating will lower you immune system, make you tired and unmotivated and will help you retain fat very nicely (at the expense of muscle/bone mass).  It will also get you craving those hit and run snacks ;)

Perhaps you might like to try adding some portions for a week and see how you feel.

On the other hand, maybe you're coming down with a cold :P
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Chris Salvato on April 07, 2008, 02:02:29 PM
+1 to BobT on that

As he suggested and as I indirectly suggested -- try to up your caloric intake and see how you feel.  You may like it, and you may be pleasantly surprised with how u feel and how it affects your body comp.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: JAB on April 14, 2008, 05:18:19 PM
im sorry to just come raining down on your worries but... me, i try not to pay attention to all this junk (i used a more serious word when i thought about this). honestly, you just have to find things that you find taste good and are healthy. I have chunky peanut butter (high in protein), milk (all over amazing), and various juices over the course of a day. I used to drink soda like crazy, and now, i just think of the health gains from eating/drinking these foods and drinks, and they don't taste very bad.

donuts are also not as bad for you as you seem to think. if you have them occasionally its ok. just because you had 2 donuts, your not going to have a heart attack, because if you did, i would have had 3 heart attacks today  :P.

anyway...some good things to have:

1. Milk - i dont like getting low fat, i want the closest thing to completely natural.
2. Juices - cranberry, orange, are my favorite
3. Peanuts - Very high in protein, i prefer to get chunky peanut butter, you get a little of everything  ;D
4. olive oil - this is actually good for you as long as you don't cook it at a very high temperature, if you do, it becomes a carsinagent (i spelled that wrong) which is very bad for you.
5. Various vegetables - it depends what you like, some things i rather raw, so i just use a peeler and take off the skin and chow down while i watch tv, other things i like to have fried (in olive oil) with other things. Fry up some vegetables in a frying pan with some meat of your choice = amazing.
6. Seafood, shrimp is really high in protein.

Fitness + good food = health

Honestly just be happy with what you eat. I wouldn't worry about daily counts and such, just be happy eating and try to eat as healthy as possible. An occasional indulgence feels good  :D
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Charles Moreland on April 14, 2008, 05:21:40 PM
I'm slightly curious to know if you even read anything that was posted in this thread
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: JAB on April 14, 2008, 05:35:48 PM
god i hate reading...i read some, and posted, then went back and read more... so to answer your comment, no i did not read fully because i am kind of tired but...anyway...

some foods that relieve stress are: almonds, tuna, salmon, whole grains, asparagus, broccoli, baked potatoes, milk and soy milk, red beans, green tea, peppermint tea, chai tea, guacamole, mixed nuts and peppermint candy. Blueberries, yogurt, fish, and fiber-rich cereals. This may help you a little bit, and  i think this is just your body reacting to changes. The human body doesn't react to changes in daily life very well, such as not being able to sleep early because you are used to going to sleep later. You also seem to be getting worried about this whole issue, and, that could possibly be contributing to the problem. If you ever watched super size me, the main character's body got really sick when he went from eating super healthy and being fit all the time to eating micky D's all the time and rarely working out (this is an exagerated example) but, this is what it seems like your body is going through.

P.S. sorry once again about only partly reading...
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Charles Moreland on April 14, 2008, 05:55:20 PM
im sorry to just come raining down on your worries but... me, i try not to pay attention to all this junk (i used a more serious word when i thought about this). honestly, you just have to find things that you find taste good and are healthy. I have chunky peanut butter (high in protein), milk (all over amazing), and various juices over the course of a day. I used to drink soda like crazy, and now, i just think of the health gains from eating/drinking these foods and drinks, and they don't taste very bad.

donuts are also not as bad for you as you seem to think. if you have them occasionally its ok. just because you had 2 donuts, your not going to have a heart attack, because if you did, i would have had 3 heart attacks today  :P.

anyway...some good things to have:

1. Milk - i dont like getting low fat, i want the closest thing to completely natural.
2. Juices - cranberry, orange, are my favorite
3. Peanuts - Very high in protein, i prefer to get chunky peanut butter, you get a little of everything  ;D
4. olive oil - this is actually good for you as long as you don't cook it at a very high temperature, if you do, it becomes a carsinagent (i spelled that wrong) which is very bad for you.
5. Various vegetables - it depends what you like, some things i rather raw, so i just use a peeler and take off the skin and chow down while i watch tv, other things i like to have fried (in olive oil) with other things. Fry up some vegetables in a frying pan with some meat of your choice = amazing.
6. Seafood, shrimp is really high in protein.

Fitness + good food = health

Honestly just be happy with what you eat. I wouldn't worry about daily counts and such, just be happy eating and try to eat as healthy as possible. An occasional indulgence feels good  :D

Seeing as you didn't read I'll clarify.

- Saying things like "honestly, you just have to find things that you find taste good and are healthy." is bad nutritional advice mainly because it's not "nutritional."

- Peanuts are not high in protein, they are high in unsaturated fat. They're protein content is fairly nice but is mostly fat.

- Milk *may* be a good choice.

- Juices (especially cranberry) are extremely high in GI

- Saying "Wouldn't worry about daily amounts" is also really bad nutritional advice.

I'll agree that you're touching on the psychological aspect of eating which in itself can be important, but is hardly anything. You've completely avoided any sense of balance which is an extremely necessary component in a diet. There is no offense meant by this, but I really think you should go check out the other articles and threads posted here about diet and nutrition, and then go read some books on it. Perhaps after all that you can start giving some sound nutritional advice. It's obvious you already have a mild interest in the subject, you just need the right walkway to learn more.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Chris Salvato on April 15, 2008, 09:06:41 AM
I was going to correct you as well, but Chad beat me to it.  Damn him.

You're advice seems sound but its not valid at all.

I don't mean this to be mean, but you should really be able to back up any of your advice with sources.  It looks like you have just learned how to eat healthy (or perhaps were never overweight or considered yourself out of shape?) and think you are on a good diet plan when you really need to improve it/understand it quite a bit.

Peanuts are a bad source of protein.  Their protein is not highly absorbed and, when compared to the amount of fat in the peanuts, this is a fat source NOT a protein source.  I don't know why so many people think peanuts are so high in protein....i don't know where this started -- all you have to do is look at the nutrition info for any peanut product to see this is invalid.

Like peanuts, shrimp is a specific consumable that may not be for everyone.  Both are allergenic catalysts that may induce an allergy with excessive consumption.  Not to mention that shrimp are extremely high in cholesterol which may force SOME people to exclude them from their diet all together.  This is just an example that you need to read more before u give adivce.

Also, i have made several posts as to why Juices and peanuts are considered less than optimal.  Perhaps you should search these forums and read these resources.  Hating to read is a good way of saying "I hate to learn"
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: JAB on April 15, 2008, 01:06:37 PM
well, everything has their positive and negative effects, and my belief is that, the brain is the most important part of the human body. If you are happy, worry very little, and have an average - above average diet, i feel that its better than being unhappy, worried, and stressed with an extremely good diet. The brain is amazing; power of suggestion.

I took what you said the wrong way, and i am sorry about that. I am also sorry if you find my information incorrect, but, our basic differences here i think is that:

I think the brain is most important, and that if your brain is in good health, your body will follow if you have a decent diet.
If you change your daily activities, your body may or may not react unpredictably, and i think this is just your body transitioning to changes.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Chris Salvato on April 15, 2008, 07:29:55 PM
your brain is a really important part of your body, if not the most important, i will give you that...

but you have to realize the effects of your DIET on your brain and how that influence of diet on the brain will alter your mood, psyche and therefore your daily performance in fitness and life activities such as sitting at your desk.

keeping your brain in good health, and your psyche in good health, is heavily dependent on diet.....a regimen of 3 donuts daily certainly will hinder that......i could go into a myriad of reasons why, but you seem to not be interested in that so i won't bother :P

if you are healthy, productive, and generally happy then there really isnt a reason to change your diet.  sure, you may be able to optimize your eating and thereby optimize your performance, but 100% optimization isn't really for everyone and it certainly isn't a requirement to be happy...

if you want to be the best you possibly can be though, limiting yourself by choosing a poor diet is a bad way to start.

you have not underestimated the importance of the brain

you have however, in my opinion, underestimated the importance of diet on the brain.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Alissa J. Bratz on April 15, 2008, 09:06:47 PM
Heh.

My original question had very little to do with diet, specifically. I am generally happy with my diet and it works for me, for the most part, when I'm paying attention to it. The original question was simply that for several weeks I had been on a downward slide and in reading the originally-posted article, I was curious as to whether re-regulating my sleep would help me get my diet back on track, or whether it was the other way round, or something else entirely. I found it interesting that the original article: (1) placed so much emphasis on sleep, and (2) seemed to also place a lot of emphasis on "food allergies/sensitivity" as a possible cause for poor performance. Both of these things surprised me because I never realized how much sleep impacted everything else, and also because I was always under the impression that food allergies were a very narrow, specific thing; and the article was making it sound like everyone could be allergic or "sensitive" to something or another, and I thought that sounded a little hokey.

So basically I was looking for clarification on that, as I am of the feeling that no matter how much I know (or think I know) about diet and nutrition, I am always eager to learn more--particularly when presented with information that seems to conflict with what I've learned in the past.

To update all of you who responded to this thread:

I decided to do a little experiment and fix my sleep schedule first and see what came out of it. This was promptly thwarted by the ballet; I got almost NO sleep all of last week due to late tech rehearsals and our performance run. My diet was shot too, as I was dependent on "on the go" snacks (if I never see a container of yogurt again I'll be happy :P ) and a messed-up eating schedule (can't eat in costume, don't want to eat too soon before warm-up or performance, yadda yadda...).  So I have yet to fully carry out the experiment.

Interestingly enough, my diet seems to have improved on its own just by virtue of my body craving the healthy stuff it's used to eating... so maybe it was just a fluke, or the result of the recent change in medication that I've made.

>shrug<

Gonna try to get more sleep this week anyhow. ;)

Thanks for all the sage advice!
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: Andy Animus Tran on April 16, 2008, 12:38:23 AM
Muse, I'm in a bit of the same predicament (as evidenced by it being 4:30AM).  I can't figure out if my sleep is affecting my diet, or if my diet is affecting my sleep..  Though it seems like you want to regulate your sleep to regulate your diet..  I'm the exact opposite.  I KNOW that I can't regulate my sleep on my own, so my only choice is to regulate my diet (the only thing I have direct control over).  Unfortunately, I'm still living as a student for the next fourteen days, running low on cash, and can't make it out ot a grocery store to buy the groceries I desperately want (I miss veggies.. :(..) .. so..  I'm a bit in a rut for awhile.  I think it may have been part of what threw my sleep off (yet again), but I can't be sure.  I just remember that Sunday night, I didn't fall asleep until 8AM for no reason wahtsoever (despite gettng a normal night's rest the night before).  In any case..  Good luck to you on your venture.  Seems we both need it, for now.

man, I'd kill for some broccoli right now.. Been living off of grains for the past week.
Title: Re: Zone (and similar) diet(s), sleep, and body chemistry?
Post by: andrehoss on November 17, 2018, 05:02:43 PM
If you want to get a good night sleep, you must take healthy diet because it helps your body to operate all the functions perfectly and assist you to sleep better.