Author Topic: Training tips!  (Read 9606 times)

Offline Phytolith

  • Moderator
  • Mangabey
  • *****
  • Posts: 260
  • Karma: +27/-18
  • Phytolith
    • View Profile
    • APK Alliance Blog
Training tips!
« on: April 24, 2008, 05:55:41 AM »
Hey everybody!  I wanted to start a thread where people could add training tips and comments!  I have a few ideas written up, I'll add them about once a week until I run out of ideas.  I don't have a video camera (yet) so I tried to make my descriptions as detailed as possible (which means the posts are kind of long, but I hope it helps!

-Phyto

Offline Phytolith

  • Moderator
  • Mangabey
  • *****
  • Posts: 260
  • Karma: +27/-18
  • Phytolith
    • View Profile
    • APK Alliance Blog
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2008, 06:01:43 AM »
So, you want to progress with your vaults (or your cat leaps or your top outs or your laches. . . ), but you're just not confident your arms will hold you.  Stereotypically women have weaker upper bodies than their male counterparts, but don't let this be an excuse – you can get strong enough arms to do any move in Parkour.  You may not be able to take it to the extremes, but that's not what Parkour is about. 

So, on with the upper body drills.

First, the basics, pull-ups and push-ups.  These moves can be challenging what ever your skill level, but they are also extremely flexible, so you can scale them to your abilities. 

The basic push-up:
   Ok, you say, I know how to do a push up, right?  Well, I've found that most people new to training Parkour have a lot of “creativity” in their push-up forms.  If you do a push-up wrong, you're not building strength. A push-up is usually thought of as an arm exercise, but it really works your core. Start lying on the ground, with your hips, chest and chin touching the floor.  Your hands should be right under your shoulders or very slightly outside of your shoulders.  Push, using your arms, in a smooth movement until they are straight.  Throughout the push-up, your chin, shoulders, hips and toes must all be in a straight line (this is plank position).  Slowly let your body back down until you're flat on the floor again.  Did any part of your body hit the ground before the other parts?  If it did, this means you're cheating.  Avoid pecking (lifting your hips so your face hits first), humping (sagging your back so your hips hit first) or breakdancing (some funky combination of hips and head).  Repeat ad nauseam. Things to focus on: keep your core tight so your shoulders, hips and feet are aligned.  Keep your face up, eyes looking forward.  Things to avoid: pecking, humping, breakdancing.
   Are 10 regular push-ups out of your level right now? You can easily scale it down.  Slightly easier are knee push-ups: pivot on your knees instead of your feet, cross your feet behind you.  Still focus on keeping a straight, strong core.  Easier still are incline push-ups – put your hands on a step or box 8-10 inches off the ground.  This puts more of your bodyweight on your feet or knees.  Taller boxes make for easier push-ups so find the height on which you can just barely do sets of 10 push-ups and work on that.  At any of these heights, you can build strength more quickly by focusing on letting yourself down VERY slowly rather than on pushing yourself up. If you need just to learn the position of a push-up, but can't do 10 leaning on a box, stand an arms-length from a wall, lean in and push yourself back out. 
   Have you been doing 10 regular push-ups for ever and ever, and still not feeling strong enough? Decline push-ups help here.  Put your feet on a low box or step, and keep raising the height as your skill increases.  Eventually, you can work on hand-stand push-ups – start facing the ground, and walk your feet up a wall, until you are nearly vertical (the higher your feet, the harder the push-up), push-up from here.  You can also work in other modifications as well: 1.  You can push up explosively, so that your hands come off the ground when you reach the top.  You can even add a clap.  2. A T-push up involves lifting one arm up and reaching it towards the ceiling at the top of the push up (you end up in the shape of a sideways T).  3. Push-ups with your hands on medicine balls or balance boards increase arm strength. 

Pull-ups: The bane of children forced to take the president's fitness tests in grade school (does anyone else remember these? - I could do everything at the 95%  level but the pull-ups, to my everlasting frustration). Pull-ups may seem intimidating because it doesn't seem like there's any way to build up the strength – you can either do them, or you can't, right?  WRONG. Like everything, pull-ups are scalable.

First, The basic pull-up. The basic pull-up starts from a straight-arm hang from a bar, hands facing forward, legs straight and relaxed. Using the arms and the core, pull the body up until the chin is above the level of the bar, without swinging the legs.  Let the body back down slowly until the arms are fully straight again.  Things to keep in mind: tilting your head to look up at the bar helps put your arms and shoulders in a more powerful position.  Always go through the whole range of motion – make sure your arms are fully straight at the bottom of each pull-up. 

How to scale it: If 10 regular pull-ups are too difficult, try one of these modifications.  Easiest are negative pull-ups.  Find (or place) a bar that is about shoulder-height (or put a large box or chair or something sturdy under a higher bar).  Grab the bar so you are in the position at the top of a pull-up, with your arms bent, hands forward, chin over the bar.  Bend your knees until your arms take the weight of your body (ideally cross your feet behind you so all your weight is on your arms, but you can keep some weight on your feet if you need).  Let yourself down into the fully extended position VERY  SLOWLY.  This builds more strength quickly than pulling yourself up.  You can work negative pull-ups from any starting position to build strength. 
   The next step up is the jumping pull-up.  Find or place a bar that is about the same height as your elbows or forearms when your arms are fully extended up.  Hang from this bar, arms straight, with your feet on the ground and your knees bent to accommodate the height. Swing your hips forward slightly, keeping your feet in place.  As you swing back, push strongly with your legs, while pulling with your arms, and jump into the full up pull-up position.  Make sure your chin goes above the bar.  As you come back down, place your feet on the ground and absorb with your knees enough that your arms come fully straight, and go right into the next pull-up by swinging forward again.  A lower bar is easier because you can use more of your jump, a higher bar gets harder.
   Once you've got jumping pull-ups down and can easily and regularly do many sets of 10 or 15 in a row, you're ready for kipping pull-ups.  A kipping pull-up has a lot of the same motions as a jumping pull-up, but your feet don't touch the ground.  Here, you start in a full hang.  Swing your knees back and forth a bit to get used to the motion, notice as you swing your legs, your hips and shoulders move, too, and you start to achieve a feeling of lightness at the top of each swing.  Once you're comfortable with controlling a swing, you're ready to kip. Look up at the bar.  Swing forward, and as you swing back, explosively lift your knees and hips forward (this will somewhat force your shoulders back, this is good).  While your knees and hips are up (at the peak of their motion, so they are, in effect, in free-fall), pull up with your arms.  Your legs will swing back as you get to the top and begin to let yourself down.  When you reach the bottom your legs should be at neutral so you're in a good position to swing them up again.  Getting a good rhythm is the hardest part of kipping pull ups, but once you have it, you can keep going for ever.  Things to keep in mind:  Your hips and shoulders move in opposite directions.  Keeping your head tilted up and eyes on the bar puts your shoulders in a better position to pull. 
   The muscle-up: If regular, dead-hang pull-ups are easy (and you're doing well on push-ups, too), you might be ready for the muscle-up.  This is a basic pull-up (usually a kipping pull-up), followed by a rotation of the arms so you end up above the bar with your arms straight.  At the top of a pull-up, lift your legs again, and swing them back to give yourself a little lift.  While you swing, rotate your shoulder so one elbow points upwards and your shoulder on that side is above the bar (watch out here, if you're not careful you can mash your breast again the bar, ouch!).  Swing again, and lift the other elbow up, the follow it quickly with a push-up on the bar.  Let yourself down sloooooowly to build strength.  As you get more skilled, you can try to lift both elbows at once, and cut out the extra swings.
   Like with push-ups, you can try doing explosive pull-ups, and clap at the top.  Another good variation is to made a circular motion with your chest: pull-up more strongly on one arm, so you're closer to one side.  as you reach the top, switch sides, so you become closer to the other arm, and let yourself down.  as you reach the bottom, switch directions.

Offline WandererInGray

  • Oryctolagus Cuniculus
  • *
  • Posts: 41
  • Karma: +0/-10
  • Katy Wagers
    • View Profile
    • KalisHonor.net
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2008, 01:38:13 PM »
Thanks for the pull-up tips Phytolith! These are the bane of my existence. :D My biggest problem is my hands are so small I usually can't get a decent grip in the first place, so negative ones might be the route to go until I can get a smaller bar or strong enough fingers.
"As you go forward into your life you will come upon a great chasm.
Jump.
It is not as wide as you think."

-Native American Saying

Offline misstanyamae

  • Patas
  • ***
  • Posts: 165
  • Karma: +18/-14
  • I am come from a battle of Deeds Not Words.
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2008, 02:49:04 PM »
Ah, grip... something I know all too well. I too have small hands and as icing to the cake I broke my right hand last fall.
There are lots of suggestions for building grip strength, but what I used was just hanging on the bar. My arms would be engaged, slightly bent and I would just hold myself in place. Phytolith, I remember those fitness tests too. I think I'm talking about the flexed arm hang here.

I can do two pull ups now. I'm going to shoot for three tonight at the gym. Keep at it, girls!
bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonnerronntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohooh

-James Joyce

her wounds     came     from the same source as her power
-Adrienne Rich

Offline Muse_of_Fire

  • Moderator
  • Hirundo Rustica
  • *****
  • Posts: 2299
  • Karma: +519/-42
  • middle-aged man in mom's basement eating Fritos
    • View Profile
    • madisonparkour.com
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2008, 08:00:39 AM »
BTW, what is 'hollow rocks', 'pistols' and "QM'?

The Hollow Rock

The Pistol

QM

If you need any more tutorials, check out Fitness>Exercise descriptions on the main APK page. :)

Incidentally, if any of these are tough for you, we can always post up progressions in this thread.
She followed slowly, taking a long time,
as though there were some obstacle in the way;
and yet: as though, once it was overcome,
she would be beyond all walking, and would fly.
--excerpt from Going Blind, Rainer Maria Rilke

www.madisonparkour.com

Offline FourEleven

  • Oryctolagus Cuniculus
  • *
  • Posts: 19
  • Karma: +0/-12
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2008, 03:49:01 AM »
Ah, thanks for the tutorial links Muse. I'll give the exercises a go. The Pistol looks like a killer, but it's one of the movements that has to be done in Wushu - so I'm sure I'll get a double-hammering with the squats this week coming up!

Offline FourEleven

  • Oryctolagus Cuniculus
  • *
  • Posts: 19
  • Karma: +0/-12
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2008, 03:51:30 AM »
Okay. I'm DEFINITELY going to need the progressions for the Pistol. I only got halfway down before I couldn't go any further!

Offline Phytolith

  • Moderator
  • Mangabey
  • *****
  • Posts: 260
  • Karma: +27/-18
  • Phytolith
    • View Profile
    • APK Alliance Blog
Lower Body workouts:
« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2008, 01:59:28 PM »
Jumping, landing, leaping and generally moving your body around quickly and smoothly all require strong legs.  We've covered upper body training with push-ups and pull-ups, onto some lower body training.

The squat: Good for training the jumping muscles! (which, by the way, are on the back of your body, your gluteal muscles, hamstrings and calves, NOT your quads).  Starting with your feet slightly more than shoulder-width apart, pointing out at a low angle, say ~15 degrees, stick your butt out.  No, I'm serious, arch your lower back so that your hips tilt forward and your bum is hanging out there.  This position is vital for a good squat, it sets your body into the good position for using the biggest muscles in your body (the glutes, the hamstrings) to move your bodyweight around.  Squat down in a slow, controlled manner, keeping your mind on your lower back and the backs of your legs.  Only go down as far as you can with your lower back curved. Tightness in the muscles of your back and your legs will be the limiting factor here.  The instant you lose the curve, you've transferred the strain to your quads, which you want to avoid.  Keep your chest up and strive not to lean too far forward: lifting your arms to shoulder height as you squat will help this.  Fight to keep your knees out, over your feet and steady – don't let them fall towards the inside or move all around as you squat and rise as this will hurt them. Don't be afraid to bend more than 90 degrees as long as you can keep your back tight. A squat may seem easy at first, but takes a while to master (and usually someone watching you to help you determine when your lower back loses its curve).  Start with sets of 5, work up to sets of 50 from there (squats very quickly get tiring). See more descriptions here: http://www.americanparkour.com/content/view/29/327/

The Pistol: Already described well elsewhere, the pistol really focuses on single leg strength.  Build up to it by doing regular squats and one-legged squats (basically a pistol, but leaving the other leg bent with the foot close to the ground rather than straight out in front).  Pistols will be nearly impossible if your hamstrings are too tight, work some regular stretches into your routine.

Pop-ups: more training of the jumping muscles!  Find a low, sturdy box or a step around 12-18 inches high.  Place your right foot on the box, and using the quad and the glutes on the right side, explosively step up and jump up off your right leg.  Jump high enough that you fully extend the right hip and that the right foot slightly lifts off the box, and then sets back down (you can swing the left knee up here to give yourself some momentum and lift).  Once the right foot has hit, bend that knee and let the left foot hit the ground.  Immediately continue with a second one on the same side.  Swinging your arms while you go helps – when your left foot is on the ground have your arms horizontal in front of you.  As you jump, swing them down, and let them come back up as you land.  Start out with ten of these on each side (do ten on the right, then ten on the left).  Increase difficulty by increasing reps and/or height of the box.

Walking lunges: With your feet about shoulder width apart, step forward with your right foot about 2 feet. It doesn't need to be too far, just far enough so you can bend both knees until they are both at about 90 degrees.  Your left heel will come up off the ground, but try to keep your weight even in both legs.  Make sure your chest is up (tight lower back) and your arms by your sides (don't put your hands at your waist, they take some of the strain that we want your core to take).  Stand and step the left foot forward and bend both knees again.  Some variations – 1) Lunge with a twist: at the bottom of each lunge turn your shoulders, arms and as much of your torso as you can (without moving your legs) to either the inside or the outside (do both, switch it up).  This works the obliques and stretches out your hips.  You can also do this while holding on to a small weight with both hands to make it a whole-body work out. 2) Lunge with calf raises.  At the top of each lunge, while you're standing on one foot, pause a moment, balance and tighten your calf until you're on tip-toe.  Put your heel back down, and step the other foot forward to continue.  This will help with general balance and lower leg strength. More on walking lunges: http://www.americanparkour.com/content/view/28/327/, and on lunges with a twist here: http://www.americanparkour.com/content/view/29/327
« Last Edit: June 23, 2008, 09:15:35 AM by Amanda Henry »

Offline paxpacis

  • Oryctolagus Cuniculus
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2008, 12:55:13 PM »
Thanks for the tips!  Those lunges burn!

Another variation on pull-ups is the shoulder roll.  You start in a dead hang, and tense your shoulders so that you rise ever so slightly  ( repeat repeat repeat).  This is an isolation exercise that really helped me increase the power in my laches. 

After talking with Tyson, I realized that I've been doing my push-ups wrong for years!  How humbling.  I totally thought I had it down, but my elbows were pointing perpendicular to my body the whole time.  When I line them up parallel I can barely do 15.  Apparently the difference is in the muscles that are working.   Parallel = triceps. Perpendicular = pectorals.  I'm hoping to gain more effective power from adding these into the daily grind.     Does anyone have previous experience with these different forms?   

Offline Muse_of_Fire

  • Moderator
  • Hirundo Rustica
  • *****
  • Posts: 2299
  • Karma: +519/-42
  • middle-aged man in mom's basement eating Fritos
    • View Profile
    • madisonparkour.com
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2008, 02:54:55 PM »
Oh there are a million different kind of pushups, all designed to work different things based on how you position your arms. Here are some that I like, in addition to the parallel/perpendicular variations you mentioned, Janine. By the way, your way was not "wrong," it was just a variation on a theme. IMO the only way pushups can be truly "wrong" is if the core/spine are not engaged, so the back is all arched and wobbly. Otherwise, the change in arm position merely changes the type of work the body is doing.

1. Crocodile/alligator pushups. Get in a QM position and take a "step" with one arm and the opposite leg, so you are more or less in this position. Make sure you are low to the ground so your back is plank-straight, like it is in a normal pushup. Do a pushup, then take another "step" so you are working the opposite side. Do a pushup. Repeat.

2. Dog pushups. Start in the yoga pose Downward-Dog. Bend your arms to lower your chest to the ground, and scoop through, straightening the arms to Upward-Dog (without letting your hips or legs touch the ground). Scoop back through, bending your arms and raising your hips, to get back to the Downward-Dog position.

3. Do normal pushups, but with one arm on a step or yoga block, or parallette. Vary the angle of the humerus to the body. Be sure to do both sides.

4. Incline and decline pushups.

5. Diamond pushups. Put the hands very close together, under the sternum. Can also be done on an incline/decline. Can also be done with the hands pointed inward, fingers towards one another.

6. Pushups with one knee out to the side, or one leg extended out to the side.

7. Pushups (any hand position) with legs on a Bosu or exercise ball

8. Side pushups. Lie on one side with the legs straight and the core engaged. Have your feet on a step or box. Place your hands close together, near the ribcage, about 4-6" away from your body. Turn your hands so that the fingers are facing one another and your arms, when bent, make a diamond shape that frames your chest. Do pushups in this position. Be sure to keep your body straight, and change sides after your desired number of repetitions.

There are more, I'll have to ask Chad for more ideas. Hope that helps!
She followed slowly, taking a long time,
as though there were some obstacle in the way;
and yet: as though, once it was overcome,
she would be beyond all walking, and would fly.
--excerpt from Going Blind, Rainer Maria Rilke

www.madisonparkour.com

Offline Phytolith

  • Moderator
  • Mangabey
  • *****
  • Posts: 260
  • Karma: +27/-18
  • Phytolith
    • View Profile
    • APK Alliance Blog
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2008, 10:44:51 AM »
It's not parkour-specific training, but I thought I'd include this as a simple at-home (or anywhere, really) training circuit that helps build strength for a lot of parkour moves.  It's what I did at home during the winter and use when it's raining and I don't want to go out.

Phytolith's favorite at home workout.
This requires a staircase and a pull-up bar.

1: Quadrupedal movement up and down the staircase.  QM is basically crawling on hands and feet instead of hands and knees.  (If you haven't done it before, try it on the ground first). Start in a plank position, then set the right hand back some and the left hand forward.  Keep the left foot back but step the right foot forward, with the knee to the outside of the arm and the foot about a foot behind the hand.  Keeping the body and the hips low, opposite hand and foot move forward at the same time, so from that starting position, lift and move the left foot and the right hand forward at the same time, so you end up in the same form as your starting position, just mirrored.  Continue moving forward.  (More description here: http://www.americanparkour.com/content/view/34/327/). QM forward up stairs is easy, QM forward down stairs is harder.  QM backwards up the stairs is hardest. Make sure your hands and feet touch each stair.

2: Pop-ups.  Standing at the bottom of the stairs, do sets of 10 pop-ups on each leg (I usually use the 2nd or 3rd step up, higher than this is harder to reach).

3: Dips.  Sit on the floor at the bottom of the stairs with your legs out in front of you.  Place your hands behind you on the 2nd stair, with the fingers facing forward and your elbows pointing up/back.  Using your triceps, straighten your arms and lift your bum off the floor, pivoting on your heels.  Keeping your butt off the ground, raise and lower yourself 10 times.  To make this easier, bend your knees slightly.  To make it harder, use a chair or higher surface (don't try to use a higher stair – the horizontal distance will become too difficult).

4: Decline push up.  Hands on the bottom of the stairs, feet up on whatever step you feel comfortable with.  10 push-ups.

5: Pull-ups: 10 of these of whatever variation, but let yourself down slowly on each one.

6: Squats: 10 good squats.

REPEAT (usually I do the whole thing about 3 times).  Up the reps of each exercise for a harder workout.

Offline Phytolith

  • Moderator
  • Mangabey
  • *****
  • Posts: 260
  • Karma: +27/-18
  • Phytolith
    • View Profile
    • APK Alliance Blog
Vaults! (it's a long one, sorry)
« Reply #11 on: May 23, 2008, 05:52:02 AM »
I suppose I should take photos, it would make these posts shorter.  But I hope the vault progressions below are helpful!

Vaulting is a combination of some physical strength with a lot of mental confidence.  No matter your level of activity right now, you CAN move yourself over a low wall or obstacle.  It may not be pretty, it may not be quick, but you can get over it.  My goal here is to give you some basic tips so that you can learn how to get over it more quickly and prettily and with a minimum of injury and fear. 

We'll start with build-up to a speed vault.
A speed vault involves passing over an obstacle while getting the torso and legs horizontal to the side, and placing only one hand on the obstacle.  It's well-described here: http://www.americanparkour.com/content/view/265/305/ The basic idea is to jump and angle your body to one side so your hips clear the obstacle by only a small amount, then use your hand on the wall to set yourself back upright.  It's generally used at high speeds, as it is good at retaining your momentum, but is not quite as effective as a kong/monkey over long objects. 

the Build up:
Find a low wall, a between mid-thigh and waist high.  Decide which of your arms you feel stronger on (for the sake of this tutorial, I'll say right, but you can do either).  Face the wall, put both of your hands on the wall in front of you, making sure there's at least another 3 feet of wall to your left.  Practice a few good jumps here (using good squat form, jump, but keep your hands on the wall).  Next, jump and put your left foot on the wall to the left of both of your hands.  Very little of the lifting effort should come from your arms, most should come from your legs.  If you can't get your foot up, you may need to practice more squat jumps to build up leg strength before proceeding, and/or find a lower wall.  Once your left foot is on the wall, you're in an awkward position, but that's ok, work through it.  Use your abs obliques and back to lift your hips, so that your shoulders and hips are more or less in a straight line with the foot that's on the wall, and are approaching parallel to the wall.  This gets your hips high enough so you can lift and bend your right leg so that it swings through underneath your left leg, and it sets you up for the feeling of getting horizontal that is vital for the speed vault.  You'll have to lift your left hand to pass your right leg through.  Step down on the other side of the wall with the right leg.  Practice this move a few times until you're comfortable.  Things to keep in mind: Try not to let the right leg touch the wall at all – don't stub your toes on the wall or hit your knee.  Pivot on your shoulder and tighten your core to lift your hips.  Remember to LET GO with your left hand.  Once your left leg is on the box, the left arm only gets in the way. 

Building up from here:  Give yourself a little speed: take two steps back and then walk forward to the wall.  Be sure that you jump off your right foot and land on the other side on your right foot.  Start to think about jumping a little bit before your hands hit the wall.  Once you're comfortable with a little momentum, the next step is to stop putting your left foot on the wall. Take two steps, jump off the right foot, THEN put both hands on the wall, swing your legs over to the left, LIFT THE LEFT HAND, land on your right foot, take two more steps on the other side. Lifting the hand and taking the two steps afterwards ensures your hips always face forward and you retain your momentum.  Finally, add a little more speed, and approach the vault at a run. Remember to try to jump and leave the ground before your hands hit the wall.  Work towards putting only your right hand on the obstacle, leaving the left hand in the air as you pass over the wall. Things to keep in mind – a tight torso and strong core will make this vault easier.  A faster approach and a big jump actually make this vault easier.  Remember to jump first, then put your hand on the wall.

The Monkey/Kong vault.


So, the speed vault was all about getting your body horizontal to the side in order to clear the wall.  The monkey is similar in that you're trying to get your body horizontal front and back to clear the wall.  If you've seen photos of a good kong, the person's body usually gets completely flat out like superman before their hands hit the wall.  This takes more confidence and mental preparation than skill, but there are a few steps you can do to build up to that.

Starting out: In order to get used to the “superman” motion, you first have to get used to jumping hard and pulling your hips high. I use the word 'pulling' because that's how I have to picture it – I'm using my lower and middle back muscles to pull my hips up.  It's good to practice this motion before actually attempting a monkey vault.  Find a wall or a table which is sturdy, about hip or belly-button height and at least a foot wide on top.  Place both hands on the wall, bend your knees and jump hard, keeping your hands on the wall and pivoting at the shoulders.  Try to get your hips ABOVE your shoulders, by arching your lower back (it's the same motion as in a squat, where you stick your butt out, only this time you're raising your butt up instead of back).  You can bend your knees a little bit, but don't think too hard about your legs at this point – concentrate instead on a big jump and getting your butt high.  Use your back and shoulders to slow yourself as you reach the peak of the jump.  You want to get the feeling of floating at the top of the jump, and prolonging this feeling as much as you can.  The kong vault uses this kind of jump, with a lot of forward momentum, to get your body over the vault box.   Imagine doing this same jump without your hands on the box: you'd become very horizontal, but your upper body would continue rotating forward.  In the kong vault your arms are used not mostly as a way of pulling you over the vault (the jump and the forward momentum should do most of this work) but as a way of pushing your upper body back upright so you don't end up in a dive roll over the object.

Once you're comfortable with the jump itself, the next step is trying to jump high enough to get your feet on the wall.  Put your hands towards the far side of the object that you're using (in a real kong, your hands will hit at the far edge of the object).  Jump, get your hips high, bend your knees and try to get your feet on the object.  You may only be able to get one foot up there at first, keep working at it until you can comfortably get both up.  Once your feet are on the wall, swing them through your arms (one at a time if necessary), and hop down on the other side of the wall. If you have to, you can sit down and then hop down.  DON'T stand up and jump down – keep your hands on the wall, get used to this motion. Practice jumping, trying to get your feet closer and closer to the far edge of the object (the further towards this edge that your hands are, the easier this will be).  As you get more and more comfortable, you may find that you can jump and swing your legs all the way through.  For those who differentiate between a monkey and a kong, this vault – low speed, no dive and swinging the legs through the arms – is a monkey.

The kong vault is similar to a monkey, but requires more speed and more of a dive into the vault.  The hands hit the wall well after the feet leave the ground, and usually leave the wall just before the feet swing through the same space.  Work up to it by trying the monkey vault with some momentum.  Run at a moderate pace at the box.  Just before jumping, swing your arms forward and up powerfully (this gives you forward/upward momentum, helps you get into a dive.  Don't do what I did when learning this vault, which was to run at the wall with my arms in the air).  Feel free to play with how you swing your arms, this motion can really help you get some momentum.  Jump at least 2 or 3 ft before the object.  Jump BEFORE you put your hands on the wall.  Try to lift your hands off the vault as soon as you feel your body get upright.  Work towards jumping from further back.  Running faster makes this vault much easier, because you have to jump less to get over the box.  Demon's tutorials on the split footed take off really help here as well. (http://www.americanparkour.com/content/view/941/324/).
« Last Edit: May 23, 2008, 09:19:53 AM by Phytolith »

Offline Amy R

  • Oryctolagus Cuniculus
  • *
  • Posts: 5
  • Karma: +3/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2008, 08:21:46 AM »
Thanks so much for all the training tips.  :) I don't have a lot of arm strength, so these progressions are helping quite a bit. I like the vaulting tips as well; they will certainly help me with proper technique. I don't have an experienced partner to help me with this stuff, so I'm happy to read about it here.

Offline riskysix

  • Guenons
  • **
  • Posts: 58
  • Karma: +2/-0
  • SHOOM... SHOOM.....WEEEEE!!!!
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #13 on: July 05, 2008, 08:02:32 AM »
these tips are awesome, thank you. TO THE GYM....er.. monday.
rock on girlz!
"A self-proclaimed masochist is one who has never encountered a treadmill..."

Offline Moshpit_Ninja

  • Oryctolagus Cuniculus
  • *
  • Posts: 1
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #14 on: August 14, 2008, 10:09:56 AM »
In my training i'm stuck at one point- my rolls.
I know i'm doing SOMETHING wrong, because they hurt my (first) shoulder whenever I do them.
Can someone help me with this? Because if I can't start nailing thoses rolls, I won't be able to go further  :-[

Offline Phytolith

  • Moderator
  • Mangabey
  • *****
  • Posts: 260
  • Karma: +27/-18
  • Phytolith
    • View Profile
    • APK Alliance Blog
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #15 on: August 14, 2008, 10:41:00 AM »
Moshpit Ninja-

Its a good question, and reminds me that I meant to add a bit of a tutorial on this as well.  Make sure you first check out the tutorial with photos on the main page (you have to be logged on to view): http://www.americanparkour.com/content/view/264/305/

The three main causes of shoulder pain that I've seen are 1) folding the arm across the chest rather than maintaining a round shape with that arm and 2) twisting the body to the side and ending up in a "barrel roll" rather than something closer to a somersault and/or 3) not reaching ahead enough with the leading arm.  Since I'm not sure which of these is causing you the problem, I'll try to address all of them.

1) The starting position for a roll is with feet separated, right foot forward, knees bent quite low but still above 90degrees, and your head tucked into left shoulder. Your right arm leads the way into the roll by making the same motion you would do in a crawl or freestyle swimming stroke: elbow pointing up and close to where your head would be if it weren't tucked, thumb pointing down.  This position puts the meaty part of your shoulder, rather than the bony part, as the first thing to land, as well as establishing the roundness in your shoulder and upper back. 

2) Make sure as you roll you push your shoulders and hips forward along the same line as the direction you're moving.  A person watching you from behind or the side will be able to tell you if you're moving straight or if you're sort of doing a barrel roll.

3) Reach OUT, not down, with the leading arm.  The lower your squat, and the more forward you push yourself, the easier this is to do.  One way to practice is to mark a spot about 18 inches in front of your leading foot, and make your arm touch the ground on the far side of that line.

Usually, I've found these three problems to be very tightly correlated, but try them one at a time and see if any help.

If none of them help, you can begin learning the roll from the ground (rather than standing) to get used to the correct posture.  The directions sound a bit like instructions for "Twister" but bear with me. Start with your left knee on the ground straight under your left hip, the left toes on the ground behind and tucked (so you can push off them).  Your right knee is bent at about 90 degrees so that your right foot is flat on the ground some distance in front of your right hip. Place your left hand, fingers pointing forward, on the ground in line with your right foot and directly in front of your left knee (left knee, left hand and right foot now create a right triangle of roughly equal sides).  Place your right hand between your left hand and right foot, fingers pointing toward you. You will have to lean forward and bend your elbow to do this.  This puts you close to the ground with your right arm and shoulder in the good position.  Tuck your head, push yourself forward using your left leg.  Once you've done it several times starting from the ground, try starting in a similar position, but with your knee off the ground (low squat, similar arm position). Work up to standing. 

Good luck, hope this helps!

Offline Jeni4

  • Oryctolagus Cuniculus
  • *
  • Posts: 38
  • Karma: +1/-2
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #16 on: August 15, 2008, 03:40:17 PM »
I had a question in the topic of pull ups
im pretty strong for my age and definitely one of the strongest girls in my school but i cannot do pull ups

a friend said its because my muscles arnt fully developed yet...what should i do?


Offline misstanyamae

  • Patas
  • ***
  • Posts: 165
  • Karma: +18/-14
  • I am come from a battle of Deeds Not Words.
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #17 on: August 17, 2008, 02:48:47 PM »
Firstly, about how old are you? I doubt its because your muscles aren't fully developed... I've seen an eight year old do a pull-up... but rather that your body is unfamiliar with the movement. Ladies, someone want to clarify what I'm talking about?
bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonnerronntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohooh

-James Joyce

her wounds     came     from the same source as her power
-Adrienne Rich

Offline Muse_of_Fire

  • Moderator
  • Hirundo Rustica
  • *****
  • Posts: 2299
  • Karma: +519/-42
  • middle-aged man in mom's basement eating Fritos
    • View Profile
    • madisonparkour.com
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #18 on: August 19, 2008, 10:12:57 PM »
Well there is "developed" like in terms of physical maturity and there is "developed" like in terms of training. Tanya, you are right in that it's got nothing to do with physical maturity. One of the first movements babies learn is a "pullup" of sorts. When they are transitioning into standing and walking they pull themselves up from a seated position all the time. And toddlers on the playground=pullup mania on the monkey bars! :)

What is lacking here is simply training: the buildup of strength and the practice to develop the coordination of all the muscles working together to achieve the goal. All you can do is practice.

In this thread on the first page there is a great post about training up to a pullup, thanks to Amanda. :)

Check that out and see if it helps; if not, let us know where you're stuck and we'll try to give you a hand.
She followed slowly, taking a long time,
as though there were some obstacle in the way;
and yet: as though, once it was overcome,
she would be beyond all walking, and would fly.
--excerpt from Going Blind, Rainer Maria Rilke

www.madisonparkour.com

Offline Jeni4

  • Oryctolagus Cuniculus
  • *
  • Posts: 38
  • Karma: +1/-2
    • View Profile
Re: Training tips!
« Reply #19 on: October 05, 2008, 09:14:07 PM »
Im like 14