Author Topic: Bodyweight Biceps  (Read 3664 times)

Offline Joe Brock

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #20 on: June 11, 2012, 11:02:25 AM »
I think you guys should stop coming to different conclusions and arguing about them, since Matt_C hasn't even replied to this thread recently

^^I was going to point out that Chris was probably just upset because Roberto called kipping pull-ups "crap."...and then I realized that this thread is probably my fault.  I could have probably just left out making fun of "curl-bros" and it wouldn't have hurt anything.

Meh.  It's been boring around here recently, and we need something to discuss.
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Offline Nick Fernandez

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #21 on: June 11, 2012, 02:26:39 PM »
Yea, I thought you guys said something about how the triceps make up most of the arm compared to the bicep. So even if you were doing something completely for aesthetics like curls, wouldn't it make more sense to do triceps work?  :o

I noticed how a lot of the guys who talk and brag exclusively about their biceps usually have weird looking arms. They look huge from the side but look like sticks from the front and back.
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Offline Chris Salvato

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #22 on: June 11, 2012, 11:52:32 PM »
I think you guys should stop coming to different conclusions and arguing about them, since Matt_C hasn't even replied to this thread recently and this is the last thing he said:

He never said he was a bodybuilder, he never SAID he wanted bigger biceps, he never said he felt like he was doing too many "pushing" exercises and not enough "pulling" exercises, nor did he ever ask for help on how to do muscle-ups or pull-ups.

He asked for help on identifying biceps exercises.  That's nonsense.  I never gave him advice, I only pointed out where that sort of advice would be useful - and it is not useful for him.
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Offline Roberto Espinoza Jr.

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #23 on: June 12, 2012, 08:16:53 AM »
Haha! Oh darn guys we don't have to argue xD We're all awesome people here right? Hehe.

What ever happened to Matt anyways?  :-\
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Offline Jason C. Astor

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #24 on: June 12, 2012, 12:49:47 PM »

What in the hell has become of this forum? Even the trolling isn't that funny anymore. ???

Bodyweight Bicep work- Chin Up and Pull up with holds and slow negative. Add some weight if you can. Tensing and holding the flexed muscle will work it a little.

Like everyone has already said, the biceps aren't really the most important muscles to focus on, but hell, chicks dig em and they are vital to a balanced human being.

1- Try not to focus "TOO" much on aesthetics as they just slow done progress in the long run

2- Don't let peoples opinions to what you should be doing hinder your own goals.

Everyone else, including but not limited to the MODS and guys that are looked up to around here, you guys are E-role models to some of these whipper snappers. I'm guessing half the dudes on this site are 17 or younger and don't know better then to post what we may think is dumb. So lets stop being trolls.

And if we are gonna troll, at least make it original or useful
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Offline Chris Salvato

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #25 on: June 12, 2012, 02:16:37 PM »
What in the hell has become of this forum? Even the trolling isn't that funny anymore. ???

Bodyweight Bicep work- Chin Up and Pull up with holds and slow negative. Add some weight if you can. Tensing and holding the flexed muscle will work it a little.

Like everyone has already said, the biceps aren't really the most important muscles to focus on, but hell, chicks dig em and they are vital to a balanced human being.

1- Try not to focus "TOO" much on aesthetics as they just slow done progress in the long run

2- Don't let peoples opinions to what you should be doing hinder your own goals.

Everyone else, including but not limited to the MODS and guys that are looked up to around here, you guys are E-role models to some of these whipper snappers. I'm guessing half the dudes on this site are 17 or younger and don't know better then to post what we may think is dumb. So lets stop being trolls.

And if we are gonna troll, at least make it original or useful

I never said he was dumb.

I said that working your biceps was silliness, and pointed out why.

Why has this caused a backlash?

Even in bodybuilding/aesthetics training, you need to be at a certain level before you start isolating muscles.  If people take that as an insult, when its not, how will they learn anything?

I clearly pointed out why it is silly.  If you don't like that explanation...then... *shrug*
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Offline Joe Brock

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #26 on: June 13, 2012, 05:22:57 AM »
Hmmm.  I have no idea why there is such backlash against this particular topic, but it probably has to do with the fact that 95% of the newer lifters who I work with will isolate biceps regardless of what you tell them to do.

I said that working your biceps was silliness, and pointed out why.

I work my biceps once a week with higher rep sets of 12-20.  Chris, is that silly? ;)
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Offline Jason C. Astor

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #27 on: June 13, 2012, 05:33:02 AM »
For me it's not a backlash of this topic specifically just the bad attitude I've seen on this site the last couple months. If we are claiming to be a community of almost enlightened athletes we shouldn't be so short with those who are yet unaware of how they could be doing things better (I'm guilty of it as well)

For the record. When I'm not injured (which seems like never) I rarely or at all do isolation exercises. But when I first started lifting that's all I did
David Belle once robbed a bank and left all the money on the Roof. He just wanted to prove that he could overcome any "Vault"..

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Offline Joe Brock

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #28 on: June 13, 2012, 06:51:06 AM »
Well, then, let's put this subject to rest:

Joe's Thinking on "Reason's to Isolate"

The discussion involving full-body workouts and isolation exercises stems from a mistaken understanding of professional bodybuilders' routines.  The "Muscle and Fitness" readers who wanted to be huge like their heroes would often see all of the isolation movements being done by IFBB Professionals and decide that what they were doing would obviously be the best possible answer to looking like they do.

The flaws in this particular train of thought are pretty significant.  The first major issue was that most professional figure athletes have a "chemical engineering" factor that the average person who would be following their plans doesn't have.  The second issue, and the one that I think needs to be pointed out more than anything else, is that they didn't get to the point that they are at by doing these exercises from the beginning.  These routines are used to polish their already very well constructed physiques, and are centered around the issues that they CURRENTLY have.

To put on the most mass, multi-joint compound lifts are a superior as they allow one to train in a manner as to hit as many muscle groups as possible in the shortest amount of time.  From all of the studies that I've read, the jury is still out on some of the sayings that you hear regarding drops in testosterone caused by working out for more than 1 hour at a time, squatting increasing HGH, test, and IGF-1 levels, etc.  This doesn't mean a great deal, though, as a well constructed routine will be centered around efficiency and here's why from my perspective:

The serious athlete has a limited amount that they can do in addition to their main routine that will not actually distract from their recovery time.  The theory of supercompensation (the post training period during which the trained function/parameter has a higher performance capacity than it did prior to the training period) leads us to believe that adding a significant amount of stress before full recovery has completed can actually cause a decrease in performance.  I don't think that the supercompensation model is 100%, but it's a good way to easily explain the need for periods of the most intense training and most restorative recovery possible.

This is where isolation can play a factor.  Where the are obvious weak points in an ADVANCED athlete, isolation can be used in small doses as "feeder" workouts to assist in major movements.  Weak point theory serves no purpose in the novice or intermediate athlete, as they don't generally have "weak points" so much as they are just weak in general.  Trying to find the weak links on a chain takes on far less significance if you're trying to pull a car, but all you have to work with is one of those little chains they attach the pens at the bank with.  You need a bigger chain, and so it's best to not waste any of the precious recovery time on isolation.

Counterpoints:  Isolation and smaller compounds work well for building a larger movement assuming the athlete is using a conjugate training system.  They can also be used to rehab injuries if done lightly, or for prehab (which is why I do it...deadlift-related biceps injuries are very common, especially in stongman events where the pulls may not be on a standard barbell).  The final point is that if an athlete is injured, they can use smaller movements to train around an injury.
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Offline Josh Vernier

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #29 on: June 13, 2012, 07:12:42 AM »
I actually found that pretty entertaining...but I think you may have scared away the OP. The main questions to ask are, what are you trying to achieve? Why do you want to achieve this? What have you been doing so far?

BTW, Joe, I may have to hold onto that little write-up for future paraphrasing (don't worry. I'll give you credit)

Offline Steve Low

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #30 on: June 13, 2012, 09:41:52 AM »
Isolations =

* good for rehab / prehab
* good for advanced/elite athletes targeting weak points
* good for chemically enhanced athletes added on top of compound movements
* good for a couple exercises for "the cherry on top" after compound exercises

Very close to what is used for splits.
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Offline Chris Salvato

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #31 on: June 14, 2012, 04:44:18 AM »

This was all mentioned much more tersely a page ago....

If you are concerned about working specific parts of the body then you are in one of three situations:
  • You are an advanced bodybuilder who wants to target their biceps for growth, since they are disproportionally smaller than the rest of your physique
  • You have recently suffered from an injury, and are looking to rehabilitate it; or have identified it as a weak point that needs strengthening to avoid injury.
  • You have no idea what you are doing and need to feel that your biceps are working, because thats what MensFitness says.

I don't mean to sound rude, but it sounds like you fall into #3.  You don't need to target your biceps - you need to get better at the movement itself.

I am not quite sure why people decided to take offense to such a benign (and informative) post.  Is the word "silly" that offensive?  Or is it that I pointed out that *most* people doing isolations don't actually know what they are doing?

If we are claiming to be a community of almost enlightened athletes we shouldn't be so short with those who are yet unaware of how they could be doing things better (I'm guilty of it as well)

I haven't been around here for months, so your assertion and its relation towards me are somewhat irrelevant.  That aside, don't mistake being terse with being rude.  Sometimes it only takes 10 words to get the point across.  I am sorry you have chosen to find this offensive.
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Offline bob smith

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #32 on: June 14, 2012, 07:09:23 PM »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-8izkNkcBw" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-8izkNkcBw</a>

I personally haven't tried this, but it's basically a bicep curl with your body (as shown, obviously)
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Offline Josh Vernier

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #33 on: June 14, 2012, 09:25:46 PM »
You can also use a TRX for the high bicep curl. Didn't even think to mention it. At least that way you get some core activation too.

Offline john sapinoso

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #34 on: June 18, 2012, 05:43:42 AM »
You can also use a TRX for the high bicep curl. Didn't even think to mention it. At least that way you get some core activation too.

You just mentioned two of my greatest as-seen-on-TV pet peeves: "TRX" and "core activation" in the same post. I think I hate you.

All kidding aside...OP simply wants to even out his movement spectra from one of mainly push oriented to one that includes more pulling. So simple answer is: grip something and pull your body up, repeat for reps.


Offline Josh Vernier

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #35 on: June 18, 2012, 11:03:06 AM »
You just mentioned two of my greatest as-seen-on-TV pet peeves: "TRX" and "core activation" in the same post. I think I hate you.

Hate me all you want. I only plug things that I truly believe in and have found to work well with clients of all kinds and levels (including traceurs, by the way).

Offline Jason C. Astor

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #36 on: June 18, 2012, 12:34:20 PM »
I think we all "need to infuse some gravity" into our bodyweight bicep work outs
David Belle once robbed a bank and left all the money on the Roof. He just wanted to prove that he could overcome any "Vault"..

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Offline Ammad

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #37 on: June 18, 2012, 01:07:53 PM »
I think we all "need to infuse some gravity" into our bodyweight bicep work outs

Oh god, no. It's spreading.

Offline Steve Low

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #38 on: June 18, 2012, 03:14:12 PM »
You just mentioned two of my greatest as-seen-on-TV pet peeves: "TRX" and "core activation" in the same post. I think I hate you.

All kidding aside...OP simply wants to even out his movement spectra from one of mainly push oriented to one that includes more pulling. So simple answer is: grip something and pull your body up, repeat for reps.

Finally spending some time on APK? :P
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Offline john sapinoso

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Re: Bodyweight Biceps
« Reply #39 on: June 18, 2012, 08:47:38 PM »
Hate me all you want. I only plug things that I truly believe in and have found to work well with clients of all kinds and levels (including traceurs, by the way).

Put bluntly, that TRX you believe in is a load of uselessness for getting people strong. I distrust anyone that uses the words "core", "functional", "zumba" unless it's directly followed by the phrase "is a load of crap". I won't say more on this here since that's not the intent of the OP's thread.

Steven, I made a user name ages ago but when I see any of the aforementioned forbidden words my blood boils and I can't hold my tongue lest some innocent bystander think it to be good advice.